Interview: Jason Charnes (Organizer)

Jason’s Blog: https://www.jasoncharnes.com/

Jason’s X: https://www.x.com/jmcharnes

Jason’s Blog Post after the first year of Southeast Ruby: https://jasoncharnes.com/organizing-southeast-ruby/

Jason’s conversation with Jason about conferences https://www.codewithjason.com/podcast/10094963-134-behind-the-scenes-of-conference-organizing-with-jason-charnes/

Transcript

1 00:00:03.640 –> 00:00:04.990 Travis Dockter: Okay, cool.

2 00:00:05.180 –> 00:00:15.719 Travis Dockter: Well, welcome to what I’ve been calling my unofficial, unprofessional interviews of conference organizers.

3 00:00:17.320 –> 00:00:25.009 Travis Dockter: so a little bit of context, I decided that I’m going to

4 00:00:25.160 –> 00:00:33.409 Travis Dockter: organize my own rails conference and I wanted to reach out to

5 00:00:33.640 –> 00:00:37.159 Travis Dockter: a bunch of other conference organizers and just try to

6 00:00:37.270 –> 00:00:40.577 Travis Dockter: soak up their knowledge, get their experience.

7 00:00:41.390 –> 00:00:50.289 Travis Dockter: ask them all kinds of questions about how they did what they did, and I know that you organized

8 00:00:50.510 –> 00:01:02.770 Travis Dockter: southeast ruby a couple times, and you actually wrote a really awesome blog post after the 1st one

9 00:01:03.516 –> 00:01:07.553 Travis Dockter: called organizing my 1st conference southeast ruby

10 00:01:08.460 –> 00:01:22.020 Travis Dockter: and I also, like I listened to. I think you did a podcast with Jason sweat on like organizing ruby conferences. So I think I’ll skip over the kind of the

11 00:01:22.190 –> 00:01:26.860 Travis Dockter: the. You know the whole story of you organizing that.

12 00:01:27.370 –> 00:01:34.680 Travis Dockter: But I want to dive a little bit deeper. To to kind of

13 00:01:34.790 –> 00:01:45.730 Travis Dockter: get a little bit deeper than maybe what that blog post was so just to clarify though it was, was it that 1st one? Was it a 2 day conference or a 1 day conference.

14 00:01:46.230 –> 00:01:49.849 Jason Charnes: It was 2 day. I think all of them were 2 day.

15 00:01:49.850 –> 00:01:54.827 Travis Dockter: There were 2 days. Okay, and you got

16 00:01:56.230 –> 00:02:06.719 Travis Dockter: how many? How many speakers did you have? I think it was like 4 keynote, and then 10 other 2. Did you have like 14 speakers in 2 days?

17 00:02:06.850 –> 00:02:09.249 Jason Charnes: Roughly. Yeah, it alternated.

18 00:02:09.880 –> 00:02:15.469 Jason Charnes: I want to say it probably alternates some each year. The last year we added some workshops in

19 00:02:15.780 –> 00:02:17.240 Travis Dockter: Okay. Cool.

20 00:02:17.240 –> 00:02:18.300 Jason Charnes: But yeah.

21 00:02:18.300 –> 00:02:19.270 Travis Dockter: Workshops.

22 00:02:19.430 –> 00:02:20.320 Jason Charnes: Do? What.

23 00:02:20.320 –> 00:02:21.849 Travis Dockter: What were the workshops.

24 00:02:22.330 –> 00:02:27.559 Jason Charnes: Let’s see here, Jason, sweat came and gave one. I’m gonna have to. It’s been so long. I pulled this up.

25 00:02:28.340 –> 00:02:30.940 Jason Charnes: 2019,

26 00:02:34.350 –> 00:02:37.569 Jason Charnes: if it will load. Oh, connection?

27 00:02:38.335 –> 00:02:39.940 Jason Charnes: Private care.

28 00:02:49.550 –> 00:03:03.109 Jason Charnes: Yeah. So Jason gave one on cleaning up legacy code and Ernesto tag worker gave one on upgrading rails.

29 00:03:03.880 –> 00:03:10.979 Jason Charnes: Then. Oh, we actually had 4 that year. Yeah. Oh, Noah Gibbs gave one on building your own web framework.

30 00:03:11.340 –> 00:03:17.869 Jason Charnes: and then Julian Farher and James Hart gave one on dockerizing rails. So.

31 00:03:18.170 –> 00:03:23.480 Travis Dockter: Nice. How did you like having those versus speakers.

32 00:03:24.610 –> 00:03:33.129 Jason Charnes: I liked it so that I forgot this year. So Thursday was just workshops, and then Friday was just talks.

33 00:03:33.410 –> 00:03:35.110 Travis Dockter: Oh, okay, so split up.

34 00:03:35.300 –> 00:03:37.260 Jason Charnes: Yeah, it was split up.

35 00:03:37.820 –> 00:03:44.440 Jason Charnes: I know my understanding was that the people the attendees enjoyed that

36 00:03:45.385 –> 00:03:47.999 Jason Charnes: I also wanted it to wear

37 00:03:48.590 –> 00:03:57.649 Jason Charnes: like we go to big conferences. Workshops compete with regular talks like they run side by side, and like we’ve had 2 workshops running side by side. But

38 00:03:57.880 –> 00:04:02.760 Jason Charnes: it wasn’t like. If I go to this workshop. I miss these 2 talks kind of thing, and I think.

39 00:04:02.760 –> 00:04:03.100 Travis Dockter: Right.

40 00:04:03.100 –> 00:04:04.689 Jason Charnes: I think that went pretty well.

41 00:04:05.550 –> 00:04:09.317 Travis Dockter: Cool. Yeah, no, that sounds like a great idea to me.

42 00:04:09.850 –> 00:04:20.430 Travis Dockter: Did you like for the workshops, did you? Was it? Did you open like a Cfp for those workshops? Or did you reach out to people and say, Hey, will you do this workshop?

43 00:04:20.829 –> 00:04:24.549 Jason Charnes: I want to say it was in the Cfp.

44 00:04:24.780 –> 00:04:25.160 Travis Dockter: Oh, okay.

45 00:04:25.160 –> 00:04:27.409 Jason Charnes: Yeah, it definitely was cause

46 00:04:29.740 –> 00:04:34.840 Jason Charnes: the the people who did the dock rising rails one like I didn’t know them before, so it would have definitely been.

47 00:04:34.840 –> 00:04:41.309 Travis Dockter: Okay, cool. So you’re like, call for talks. Or if you want to do a a workshop kind of a thing.

48 00:04:41.310 –> 00:04:49.849 Jason Charnes: Yeah. And we did the workshop as an add on so like, you could just buy like the conference ticket for the one day. But it’s like additional $80 to do the workshop.

49 00:04:50.330 –> 00:04:54.779 Travis Dockter: Oh, okay, cool. I’m assuming, like for the workshop

50 00:04:55.060 –> 00:04:57.990 Travis Dockter: people. That was the same kind of

51 00:04:58.480 –> 00:05:03.209 Travis Dockter: deal that the speakers got like you would pay for their travel, or something like that.

52 00:05:03.590 –> 00:05:09.780 Jason Charnes: Yeah, the we did not. We weren’t able to like fully pay for travel we did.

53 00:05:10.640 –> 00:05:19.359 Jason Charnes: The 1st year we paid for hotel rooms for speakers, and that like we lost. I mean, we lost my wife and I lost so much money the 1st year.

54 00:05:20.130 –> 00:05:27.130 Jason Charnes: that we were. We were just like, we can’t do this. So I want to say, like, we spent like 7 or 8 grand on hotel rooms the 1st year.

55 00:05:27.480 –> 00:05:28.020 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

56 00:05:28.020 –> 00:05:34.850 Jason Charnes: And running these like small conferences. I mean running any conference. Really, margins are small. But

57 00:05:35.320 –> 00:05:39.719 Jason Charnes: the yeah, the workshops, if I remember correctly, they like

58 00:05:40.220 –> 00:05:42.439 Jason Charnes: much like the speakers. They get a stipend.

59 00:05:43.040 –> 00:05:48.050 Jason Charnes: If we invite you to do a keynote, we would.

60 00:05:50.200 –> 00:05:58.160 Jason Charnes: I think we’d do a little extra like because we invited you. I want to say maybe we did hotels for keynotes, but I can’t. I can’t exactly remember.

61 00:05:58.750 –> 00:06:00.525 Travis Dockter: Okay, okay,

62 00:06:02.280 –> 00:06:05.290 Travis Dockter: So when you

63 00:06:05.440 –> 00:06:34.120 Travis Dockter: for the 1st one, specifically. So, I have more more interest in that sometimes, because, I like to hear about how people were thinking when they didn’t know anything, and then maybe their reflections on that, and how they would have changed stuff. But on that 1st one when you reached out to your keynote speakers. Do you remember if you already had connections with those people, or were you reaching out cold to get keynote speakers.

64 00:06:34.330 –> 00:06:36.969 Jason Charnes: I was mostly reaching out cold.

65 00:06:38.368 –> 00:06:41.440 Jason Charnes: So oddvie Grimm. I did not know

66 00:06:42.050 –> 00:06:49.559 Jason Charnes: personally like we may have met at like a Ruby Conference or something like that. But at the time he was living in Knoxville, Tennessee.

67 00:06:50.000 –> 00:06:55.860 Jason Charnes: and it kind of felt like a perfect like, hey? You know.

68 00:06:56.590 –> 00:07:00.860 Jason Charnes: he could drive to it right? And so we actually.

69 00:07:01.230 –> 00:07:05.000 Jason Charnes: because of that Oddvispoke every year as a keynote.

70 00:07:05.000 –> 00:07:09.070 Jason Charnes: Oh, nice he it was! It was cool, it kind of he called it his home conference

71 00:07:10.300 –> 00:07:20.019 Jason Charnes: Ben Ornstein I met in person at Microconf that same year earlier in the year, and so I asked him in person he was.

72 00:07:20.180 –> 00:07:23.700 Jason Charnes: But yeah, I’ll do it, Ernie Miller.

73 00:07:24.030 –> 00:07:29.439 Jason Charnes: I don’t actually think so. I knew of Ernie. I’d seen him talk. I loved Ernie.

74 00:07:29.650 –> 00:07:31.939 Jason Charnes: but I don’t think we knew each other personally yet.

75 00:07:32.250 –> 00:07:34.480 Jason Charnes: but he was in Louisville at the time.

76 00:07:35.080 –> 00:07:43.909 Jason Charnes: which is about a couple hours north of Nashville, and so he was like, yeah, like I’d love to do it. And then, Kinsey, I want to say I met.

77 00:07:44.160 –> 00:07:47.330 Jason Charnes: I want to say we might have known each other through conferences before that.

78 00:07:47.950 –> 00:07:54.679 Jason Charnes: But yeah, so if if I did know anyone it was.

79 00:07:55.520 –> 00:07:57.070 Jason Charnes: it couldn’t have been like, you password

80 00:07:57.070 –> 00:08:00.010 Jason Charnes: this level. Yeah, like so, but

81 00:08:00.150 –> 00:08:02.559 Jason Charnes: everybody I asked was super receptive.

82 00:08:02.900 –> 00:08:06.041 Travis Dockter: Awesome. That’s cool, that’s cool. To hear.

83 00:08:06.880 –> 00:08:20.355 Travis Dockter: What was the what was the timeline on that 1st one in the in the blog post. It says you you had your your paternity leave idea. You’re probably your your sleep deprived Crazy idea.

84 00:08:20.730 –> 00:08:21.539 Jason Charnes: Yeah. Man.

85 00:08:21.540 –> 00:08:29.120 Travis Dockter: In December 2016. And then when was when was that actual 1st conference.

86 00:08:30.192 –> 00:08:34.450 Jason Charnes: That conference was in October of that year.

87 00:08:34.799 –> 00:08:40.189 Travis Dockter: Okay? And did you? When did you kind of start working on it in earnest? Then kind of how?

88 00:08:40.459 –> 00:08:41.989 Travis Dockter: How long was that? How long.

89 00:08:41.990 –> 00:08:45.450 Jason Charnes: Oh, so we, you know, we started.

90 00:08:46.170 –> 00:08:48.620 Jason Charnes: We started pretty early in the year.

91 00:08:49.520 –> 00:08:54.069 Jason Charnes: There was only so much like upfront we could do. We

92 00:08:56.020 –> 00:08:58.620 Jason Charnes: kind of once we lock down the dates in the venue.

93 00:08:59.390 –> 00:09:01.440 Jason Charnes: We did that as early as we could.

94 00:09:02.110 –> 00:09:06.350 Jason Charnes: so we drove up to we so, as an important thing to maybe note.

95 00:09:06.850 –> 00:09:17.620 Jason Charnes: It doesn’t really matter, but we live in Memphis, and the conference was in Nashville, and that’s like a 3 h drive from us. So we actually like we went up there like looked at a venue things like that.

96 00:09:18.170 –> 00:09:22.569 Jason Charnes: and locked that down, probably probably like March

97 00:09:22.850 –> 00:09:26.269 Jason Charnes: April. If I had to if I had to guess. And then

98 00:09:26.930 –> 00:09:35.290 Jason Charnes: it was a lot of just like sitting and waiting like watching a lot of the ticket sales like they. They trickled in slowly.

99 00:09:35.920 –> 00:09:41.158 Jason Charnes: They kind of didn’t ramp up till towards the end. So it’s kind of like, oh, shit like

100 00:09:42.320 –> 00:09:44.229 Jason Charnes: is anyone gonna be here.

101 00:09:44.330 –> 00:09:45.780 Travis Dockter: Yeah, and so.

102 00:09:46.170 –> 00:09:47.829 Jason Charnes: But yeah, it I mean

103 00:09:48.490 –> 00:09:58.619 Jason Charnes: on and off throughout the year. But really the the majority of work was like at the beginning. And then definitely like couple of days before the conference, we were just in go mode.

104 00:09:59.110 –> 00:10:00.165 Travis Dockter: Gotcha

105 00:10:01.960 –> 00:10:03.690 Travis Dockter: How did you

106 00:10:04.500 –> 00:10:13.558 Travis Dockter: market it like it? So in the blog post it says you had some social media. Ruby ruby flow reddit

107 00:10:14.030 –> 00:10:16.210 Jason Charnes: I forgot about ruby flow. Yeah.

108 00:10:16.360 –> 00:10:23.930 Jason Charnes: I just put it out there. I put it on rubyconferences.org

109 00:10:24.460 –> 00:10:29.679 Travis Dockter: Did. How you market change from the 1st year to the last year like, did you learn anything.

110 00:10:30.710 –> 00:10:33.550 Jason Charnes: Oh, not particularly.

111 00:10:35.090 –> 00:10:37.790 Jason Charnes: I didn’t particularly change anything, but

112 00:10:38.830 –> 00:10:44.749 Jason Charnes: having the 1st year under our books, had, like established the conference as legitimate

113 00:10:45.492 –> 00:10:49.387 Jason Charnes: like people had actually come to this thing like

114 00:10:50.060 –> 00:10:52.789 Jason Charnes: had taken pictures like tweeted about it. So.

115 00:10:52.790 –> 00:10:53.360 Travis Dockter: Right.

116 00:10:55.090 –> 00:11:02.010 Jason Charnes: Not like. It was like this huge popular conference, just that, like the next year when it rolled around. And we’re like, Hey, southeast Ruby. It wasn’t.

117 00:11:02.560 –> 00:11:06.499 Jason Charnes: It was like, Oh, I some people like I’ve heard. Maybe I’ve heard about that before. Things like that.

118 00:11:06.500 –> 00:11:08.640 Travis Dockter: Right? Right? Gotcha.

119 00:11:13.440 –> 00:11:25.760 Travis Dockter: okay, at at the end of your post you wrote a couple ideas that I wanted to ask you about. Now to see if you applied them, or

120 00:11:26.350 –> 00:11:43.809 Travis Dockter: had changed your mind on them or anything. So at the end of the post one of the ideas you put was offer tickets to people who wouldn’t be able. You wish you would have offered tickets more tickets to people who wouldn’t be able to attend conferences normally. Were you able to do that in later years? And how did you.

121 00:11:49.900 –> 00:11:56.679 Jason Charnes: I’m trying to think we were able to work with people with like discounts and stuff.

122 00:11:56.680 –> 00:11:57.069 Jason Charnes: Oh, my God!

123 00:11:57.070 –> 00:12:08.910 Jason Charnes: If they write in! We gave away some sponsorship. Oh, one thing we actually did was like bake in sponsorships, like, if you want to donate giving away a ticket, things like that.

124 00:12:08.910 –> 00:12:09.250 Travis Dockter: Right.

125 00:12:09.250 –> 00:12:13.979 Jason Charnes: So we did that in later years. I was glad we did that you. It’s surprising

126 00:12:14.380 –> 00:12:21.080 Jason Charnes: how hard it is to give away free tickets, though, because it involves travel. Things like that, like.

127 00:12:21.080 –> 00:12:21.980 Travis Dockter: Right.

128 00:12:21.980 –> 00:12:27.300 Jason Charnes: A lot of times we’d be like, Hey, like, here’s a free ticket they’re like, Oh, thanks! Like I can’t make it.

129 00:12:27.300 –> 00:12:27.740 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

130 00:12:27.740 –> 00:12:30.755 Jason Charnes: So you kind of like cycle through the list.

131 00:12:31.090 –> 00:12:33.763 Travis Dockter: Yeah, were there?

132 00:12:36.110 –> 00:12:53.549 Travis Dockter: so I think I read in the 1st year the tickets were like 1, 75, or something like that. Did ticket prices go up, or did you kinda keep it? Because that was actually like a pretty cheap conference ticket? And I think that’s really cool. I would like to keep ticket prices lower.

133 00:12:53.870 –> 00:12:59.900 Travis Dockter: so that hopefully, more people are able to do it. But is, did that change at all?

134 00:12:59.900 –> 00:13:01.050 Jason Charnes: It did.

135 00:13:02.590 –> 00:13:08.699 Jason Charnes: We lost my wife, and I like funded the conference. We lost

136 00:13:08.810 –> 00:13:12.810 Jason Charnes: almost 10 grand the 1st year, and so, like

137 00:13:13.130 –> 00:13:17.010 Jason Charnes: luckily I had some like side consulting. I had done, and

138 00:13:18.590 –> 00:13:23.065 Jason Charnes: and was able to write off that all my taxes which helped but

139 00:13:23.780 –> 00:13:25.920 Jason Charnes: so we had to raise the price.

140 00:13:26.140 –> 00:13:26.830 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

141 00:13:26.830 –> 00:13:32.630 Jason Charnes: I can’t remember what it was in 2018, but by 2019 I’m pretty sure it went up to like 2, 95.

142 00:13:33.150 –> 00:13:33.530 Travis Dockter: Okay.

143 00:13:36.570 –> 00:13:37.700 Travis Dockter: Yeah, cause I’m.

144 00:13:37.700 –> 00:13:39.059 Jason Charnes: Getting that wrong. But.

145 00:13:39.410 –> 00:14:04.999 Travis Dockter: I maybe I’m making the same mistake that you did the 1st year, but I’m like looking at my venue price, and I’m looking at like, you know, some other prices, and I’m like I think I could do this. I I think I could keep my tickets under 200. I think something that you did the 1st year that you mentioned that you regretted was like room block and catering.

146 00:14:06.260 –> 00:14:07.170 Jason Charnes: We?

147 00:14:07.520 –> 00:14:11.569 Jason Charnes: So we actually didn’t use a hotel the 1st 2 years. So we didn’t have.

148 00:14:11.570 –> 00:14:12.010 Travis Dockter: Okay.

149 00:14:12.010 –> 00:14:22.309 Jason Charnes: Block we did. That was the year that we did pay for the keynote or no paid for all speakers hotels, and that was really our biggest expense, and it’s something I.

150 00:14:22.310 –> 00:14:23.520 Travis Dockter: Much catered as well.

151 00:14:23.520 –> 00:14:36.419 Jason Charnes: We had lunch catered. That was I. You know there are a lot of conferences afterwards that I went to that were like we. Just. You’re on your own for lunch. I was like, Damn! That’s a good! I wish we I still all 3 years. We never did that, and I wish we would have

152 00:14:36.760 –> 00:14:44.050 Jason Charnes: but by the 3rd year, like we kind of dialed in what we were gonna spend

153 00:14:44.380 –> 00:14:44.910 Travis Dockter: Okay.

154 00:14:44.910 –> 00:14:49.180 Jason Charnes: And something that helped again. I think.

155 00:14:49.420 –> 00:14:53.630 Jason Charnes: after the 1st year, like being established, and putting that in, quotes air quotes.

156 00:14:53.970 –> 00:14:58.639 Jason Charnes: it was easier, not easy, but easier to get sponsors the next 2 years.

157 00:14:58.640 –> 00:15:00.270 Travis Dockter: Cheers, yeah.

158 00:15:02.000 –> 00:15:11.240 Jason Charnes: and I think you know, one year we had someone from Dockyard write a blog post like on the dockyard blog about the conference, and like that was just

159 00:15:11.840 –> 00:15:18.109 Jason Charnes: I mean, personally, it was wonderful like it was, you know. It felt good that somebody liked enough to do that. But it was, you know.

160 00:15:18.570 –> 00:15:20.019 Jason Charnes: all that stuff helped.

161 00:15:20.200 –> 00:15:30.010 Travis Dockter: Yeah. How did you get sponsors that 1st year? Was that another just like reaching out cold? And you got lucky, or did you have some connections that helped there.

162 00:15:32.170 –> 00:15:36.899 Jason Charnes: The 1st year sponsors was tough.

163 00:15:37.280 –> 00:15:44.400 Jason Charnes: so I’m looking at the list of sponsors, honey badger they sponsored.

164 00:15:46.730 –> 00:15:50.030 Jason Charnes: I want to say they may have sponsored the.

165 00:15:50.140 –> 00:15:55.569 Travis Dockter: One of the after parties like we did an open bar, and we did that like at the venue.

166 00:15:56.080 –> 00:15:58.539 Jason Charnes: Hired, you know, bartenders, things like that

167 00:15:58.680 –> 00:16:10.159 Jason Charnes: Ramsey solutions. So that’s like Dave Ramsey, the money guy his companies like his whole operations in Nashville, and they used to do a lot of ruby. I don’t know if they do anymore, but.

168 00:16:10.160 –> 00:16:11.520 Travis Dockter: Really, I didn’t know that.

169 00:16:11.520 –> 00:16:17.320 Jason Charnes: Yeah, they were like a big rail shop. They?

170 00:16:17.700 –> 00:16:20.519 Jason Charnes: I want to say they sponsor financially as well.

171 00:16:21.485 –> 00:16:25.870 Jason Charnes: But they also what was really cool about working with them is.

172 00:16:26.430 –> 00:16:31.150 Jason Charnes: they were like, Hey, we, you know, we’re sending our employees.

173 00:16:31.600 –> 00:16:38.119 Jason Charnes: you know, a handful of them, but also like we’re sending them to help. So like if you need help setting up like

174 00:16:40.600 –> 00:16:50.059 Jason Charnes: So many wonderful like individuals, too, like there’s a guy named John Sloan like we became friends. We stayed in touch for a while, you know. He was there all 3 years. Just great.

175 00:16:50.220 –> 00:16:59.869 Jason Charnes: But those were in clear function. They were. They’re a local company here in Memphis. They sponsored, but like I’m look, those were the 3, but they were all, if I remember, kind of like, you know.

176 00:17:01.640 –> 00:17:04.220 Jason Charnes: I don’t use the term like lower level.

177 00:17:04.750 –> 00:17:11.415 Jason Charnes: It just wasn’t like high, high monetary sponsorships, right? They were super helpful, but

178 00:17:13.119 –> 00:17:15.519 Travis Dockter: They weren’t like huge companies donating.

179 00:17:15.920 –> 00:17:25.599 Jason Charnes: They weren’t like. Oh, here’s a $10,000 sponsorship, right? And I again. So like the other 3 ice lab Ambu labs

180 00:17:27.010 –> 00:17:37.250 Jason Charnes: and prompt. So Ice Lab and Ambu Labs. They were sponsors because they paid for travel for the speakers, their speakers. And so I was like, Hey, if you’ll do that, I’ll issue as a sponsor.

181 00:17:37.430 –> 00:17:43.590 Jason Charnes: And then prompt was it actually merged with open, sourcing mental illness.

182 00:17:44.748 –> 00:17:48.210 Jason Charnes: It’s just like a kind of awareness.

183 00:17:48.960 –> 00:17:52.965 Jason Charnes: Nonprofit for mental health with developers. And I actually had

184 00:17:53.820 –> 00:18:00.660 Jason Charnes: a personal connection. There’s a developer here in Memphis who helps like manage it. So I’ve kind of tell you all the sponsors just to kind of give you an idea of like.

185 00:18:00.660 –> 00:18:01.050 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

186 00:18:01.050 –> 00:18:07.460 Jason Charnes: Just because they were listed as a sponsor that for sure didn’t mean, you know, it wasn’t necessarily directly financial or

187 00:18:07.750 –> 00:18:12.710 Jason Charnes: even like, why did you lose so much money? It was. This was very helpful.

188 00:18:13.390 –> 00:18:16.400 Jason Charnes: and we just like mismanaged the whole thing.

189 00:18:17.070 –> 00:18:19.189 Jason Charnes: No, we didn’t. We didn’t know we were doing so.

190 00:18:19.190 –> 00:18:20.210 Travis Dockter: Yeah, yeah.

191 00:18:20.510 –> 00:18:21.620 Travis Dockter: Gotcha.

192 00:18:21.730 –> 00:18:23.740 Travis Dockter: So one of the oh, go ahead.

193 00:18:23.740 –> 00:18:30.559 Jason Charnes: Shout out to Honey Badger for sponsoring that after party, because also I had no idea how much like

194 00:18:31.000 –> 00:18:33.390 Jason Charnes: alcohol to buy, and I ended up

195 00:18:33.760 –> 00:18:37.860 Jason Charnes: bringing boxes up at home, and like friends would come over and be like.

196 00:18:37.990 –> 00:18:39.959 Jason Charnes: Are you sure you don’t want like.

197 00:18:39.960 –> 00:18:41.149 Travis Dockter: You want to take a box.

198 00:18:41.150 –> 00:18:45.359 Jason Charnes: You don’t want a whole handle of gin like what is like. You don’t want to take this home so.

199 00:18:45.859 –> 00:19:01.340 Travis Dockter: Yeah. Well, what so another another thought that you put down at the end of that very 1st blog post was, make sponsorship more affordable and appealing, did you?

200 00:19:01.340 –> 00:19:03.869 Travis Dockter: Why, we didn’t have sponsors. Yeah.

201 00:19:04.310 –> 00:19:05.330 Jason Charnes: Okay.

202 00:19:05.630 –> 00:19:08.970 Jason Charnes: So when you said at the beginning of this call.

203 00:19:10.090 –> 00:19:27.530 Jason Charnes: you wrote a blog post. I hadn’t even thought about that blog post in like 4 years. So yeah, that is, that is actually why we didn’t have sponsors. The 1st year, too, is we did it too high. And so like, I want to say Ramsey became a sponsor because they’re like we’re going to buy X number of tickets in exchange for our logo kind of thing.

204 00:19:30.080 –> 00:19:33.319 Jason Charnes: And then so clear function might have been our only like

205 00:19:33.960 –> 00:19:42.470 Jason Charnes: sponsor, like honey. Badger was for the after party. So the next years we released like a prospectus for sponsorship.

206 00:19:42.830 –> 00:19:51.159 Jason Charnes: And the next year, actually, Ernie Miller, who’s a keynote speaker the 1st year was like, I love this. I want to help you. So he actually became like a Co. Organizer with us.

207 00:19:51.760 –> 00:19:57.416 Jason Charnes: and he handled all the sponsorships that year, too. So, like we put the perspectives together.

208 00:19:57.960 –> 00:19:59.269 Jason Charnes: I might even be able to

209 00:19:59.490 –> 00:20:01.289 Jason Charnes: find it. But we had more

210 00:20:01.760 –> 00:20:06.250 Jason Charnes: that, you know. We add the like, do you want to buy a ticket for someone in the community?

211 00:20:06.490 –> 00:20:06.910 Travis Dockter: Right.

212 00:20:06.910 –> 00:20:07.550 Jason Charnes: You know.

213 00:20:08.120 –> 00:20:12.059 Jason Charnes: Do you just want your logo on the website? Do you want to shout out things like that?

214 00:20:12.340 –> 00:20:12.880 Travis Dockter: Right.

215 00:20:12.880 –> 00:20:19.750 Jason Charnes: And so the next year we had much more in terms of sponsorship.

216 00:20:21.540 –> 00:20:26.550 Jason Charnes: So shipped was a sponsor. They

217 00:20:28.125 –> 00:20:36.994 Jason Charnes: their shop in Alabama now and then, like we had a couple of bronze sponsors. We had one company do the scholarship, so we actually kind of split it up

218 00:20:37.930 –> 00:20:41.660 Jason Charnes: into like real tears, and that went a lot better.

219 00:20:41.940 –> 00:20:46.029 Jason Charnes: And to the point. By the last year we didn’t have as many sponsors.

220 00:20:46.360 –> 00:20:54.479 Jason Charnes: but, like, listen, 3, 60 bold penguin, the easy. These companies

221 00:20:56.460 –> 00:21:03.330 Jason Charnes: they sponsored like pretty high financially. And Honey badger actually sponsored. Did they do all 3 years?

222 00:21:03.810 –> 00:21:06.440 Jason Charnes: I know for sure, honey badger the last year.

223 00:21:07.160 –> 00:21:13.010 Jason Charnes: This is my favorite thing about honey, badger sponsorships, any conference you go through? They sponsor. It’s not like

224 00:21:14.690 –> 00:21:16.449 Jason Charnes: a traditional sponsorship.

225 00:21:16.670 –> 00:21:26.180 Jason Charnes: So they actually were like, Hey, find something you need to do. So we got an ice cream truck to come to the conference, and, like we all went outside had ice cream like,

226 00:21:26.980 –> 00:21:29.780 Jason Charnes: yeah, how many Badger?

227 00:21:29.900 –> 00:21:31.910 Jason Charnes: I’d be remiss if I didn’t like.

228 00:21:32.480 –> 00:21:33.939 Travis Dockter: Just sit here and talk.

229 00:21:34.250 –> 00:21:49.029 Jason Charnes: Yeah, because it’s not like they sponsor. You know, I was on a podcast. Called remote ruby. It still goes. But I was, you know they were our 1st and really only sponsor. And they’re still, as far as I know, they’re still sponsoring the podcast they’re just really good for the community. But.

230 00:21:49.270 –> 00:21:49.600 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

231 00:21:49.600 –> 00:21:50.500 Jason Charnes: I digress.

232 00:21:50.790 –> 00:21:55.620 Travis Dockter: Yeah. You see them everywhere on sponsorship stuff. They they give back a lot.

233 00:21:56.110 –> 00:21:56.880 Jason Charnes: Yeah.

234 00:21:59.720 –> 00:22:10.019 Travis Dockter: Okay. Another thought that you put down at the end of that was incorporate families more. What did you mean by that? And were you able to do anything around that in later years?

235 00:22:10.020 –> 00:22:14.299 Jason Charnes: Not really you know we did the conference on Thursday, Friday.

236 00:22:14.490 –> 00:22:15.130 Travis Dockter: Hmm.

237 00:22:15.530 –> 00:22:21.330 Jason Charnes: I think every year, and the idea was that, you know, spend the weekend in Nashville.

238 00:22:21.330 –> 00:22:24.249 Jason Charnes: you know, if you want to. So there was always kind of the hope

239 00:22:25.430 –> 00:22:38.820 Jason Charnes: that that would happen. And you know, could we provide childcare things like that? But we were just so small like, you know I saw Ruby Comp do that, I thought, oh, that’s cool. I want to do that. But there’s no way in hell. I could afford to do that, or you know, and like.

240 00:22:38.820 –> 00:22:39.370 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

241 00:22:41.240 –> 00:22:42.980 Jason Charnes: My son

242 00:22:43.240 –> 00:22:55.070 Jason Charnes: wasn’t even one at the time we had that conference, but he was there with me, and I think that was my oldest. I think that was probably a big motivator for me to want to include that more. But.

243 00:22:55.360 –> 00:22:56.050 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

244 00:22:56.080 –> 00:22:57.039 Jason Charnes: I don’t know.

245 00:22:57.220 –> 00:23:01.770 Jason Charnes: There’s also something beautiful about having some time away, so I don’t. You know.

246 00:23:02.383 –> 00:23:07.289 Travis Dockter: True. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I’m thinking of doing

247 00:23:08.329 –> 00:23:19.859 Travis Dockter: my conference in the summer. So I’m yeah. I’m trying to think about like, okay, kids are out of school. You know, if people want to make it a trip to

248 00:23:20.050 –> 00:23:25.310 Travis Dockter: exotic Albuquerque, New Mexico. How can I kind of do

249 00:23:25.630 –> 00:23:28.710 Travis Dockter: a little bit more to make that easier.

250 00:23:28.860 –> 00:23:30.090 Jason Charnes: But yeah.

251 00:23:30.690 –> 00:23:31.300 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

252 00:23:31.300 –> 00:23:32.350 Jason Charnes: No, I get that.

253 00:23:32.530 –> 00:23:35.330 Jason Charnes: It’s yeah. It’s a tough balance.

254 00:23:35.510 –> 00:23:37.810 Travis Dockter: Hmm, yeah.

255 00:23:38.470 –> 00:23:39.380 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

256 00:23:40.650 –> 00:23:57.660 Travis Dockter: okay, on that same blog post. The very last thought you put was, Have co-organizers or more volunteers. Obviously, you just mentioned that you the very next year you had a had a co-organizer. How did you guys kind of split up?

257 00:23:59.110 –> 00:24:00.400 Travis Dockter: Responsibilities.

258 00:24:00.740 –> 00:24:01.750 Jason Charnes: Good question.

259 00:24:02.280 –> 00:24:08.219 Jason Charnes: So I so Ernie did join us, and I

260 00:24:08.910 –> 00:24:14.900 Jason Charnes: took a lot of credit for southeast ruby. But it wasn’t, you know it wasn’t

261 00:24:15.620 –> 00:24:23.883 Jason Charnes: I? I deserved probably none of it other than like I was like, oh, I want to do this because really my wife was like a co-organizer.

262 00:24:24.710 –> 00:24:28.390 Jason Charnes: I think she so.

263 00:24:29.300 –> 00:24:31.439 Jason Charnes: She had just become a stay-at-home mom.

264 00:24:31.780 –> 00:24:37.010 Jason Charnes: and so like, you know, that freed her up a little bit to kind of help with it.

265 00:24:37.630 –> 00:24:40.349 Jason Charnes: And so, you know, the 1st year

266 00:24:40.980 –> 00:24:45.919 Jason Charnes: it was us at Costco, you know, the day before, just like

267 00:24:46.870 –> 00:24:49.450 Jason Charnes: spending a thousand dollars on things.

268 00:24:50.300 –> 00:24:51.369 Jason Charnes: So we learned.

269 00:24:51.470 –> 00:25:02.870 Jason Charnes: oh, how to delegate a little bit more of that stuff. We also started offering volunteer tickets explicitly for free in exchange, you know, for for showing up early helping

270 00:25:03.250 –> 00:25:04.659 Jason Charnes: being available.

271 00:25:05.000 –> 00:25:06.209 Jason Charnes: I think we did that

272 00:25:06.380 –> 00:25:12.790 Jason Charnes: if we didn’t do the 1st year, we definitely did the second, 3, rd and I was really inspired to do that

273 00:25:13.140 –> 00:25:22.159 Jason Charnes: because of like the Ramsey Solution folks that 1st year they were just like super helpful. Actually, the second year, this is a little bit of a digression. But the second year

274 00:25:24.250 –> 00:25:32.930 Jason Charnes: Ramsey solutions was the actual venue. We have the conference they have at their old location. They had an event. Space that was.

275 00:25:33.630 –> 00:25:37.950 Jason Charnes: It’s hard to kind of like describe it in terms of size. But imagine.

276 00:25:38.140 –> 00:25:42.169 Jason Charnes: I don’t know. Like, imagine the size of a basketball gym, or something like that.

277 00:25:42.170 –> 00:25:42.790 Travis Dockter: Yep.

278 00:25:42.790 –> 00:25:49.310 Jason Charnes: And like full stage lights, audio and they were like yo like

279 00:25:49.600 –> 00:25:51.239 Jason Charnes: we want to have it here.

280 00:25:51.900 –> 00:25:56.929 Jason Charnes: for you know they didn’t charge us and so that’s why they were the diamond sponsor.

281 00:25:56.930 –> 00:25:57.930 Travis Dockter: Amazing yeah.

282 00:25:58.248 –> 00:26:02.929 Jason Charnes: So you know, it wasn’t Nashville proper per se

283 00:26:04.330 –> 00:26:07.960 Jason Charnes: It was a I guess, Brentwood, technically. But you know.

284 00:26:08.080 –> 00:26:13.790 Jason Charnes: people came, and that was actually, that was a really successful one. But we had a lot of help that year.

285 00:26:14.450 –> 00:26:22.110 Jason Charnes: because again, they were like, You’re doing it here. Any employees like that are going to attend the conference can help.

286 00:26:23.273 –> 00:26:24.840 Jason Charnes: Yeah. So

287 00:26:25.000 –> 00:26:33.370 Jason Charnes: the Ernie and I delegated Ernie and I kind of split. So he did more of the sponsorship like we came up with the perspectives together. But he handled more of the

288 00:26:33.970 –> 00:26:37.180 Jason Charnes: the outreach or the finalizing

289 00:26:37.340 –> 00:26:44.619 Jason Charnes: the deals. Things like that. We always did the Cfp. Together. We also had some help doing the Cfps.

290 00:26:45.040 –> 00:26:51.000 Jason Charnes: I know Jacob Harrington helped us one year. He’s a buddy of mine in Arkansas.

291 00:26:52.840 –> 00:26:59.889 Jason Charnes: We had some, just, you know, miscellaneous people help us with that because we didn’t necessarily want it to just be like just me and Ernie doing it. We wanted.

292 00:27:02.220 –> 00:27:03.729 Travis Dockter: Or something like, let me put.

293 00:27:03.730 –> 00:27:06.479 Jason Charnes: Yeah, more input, I think, in hindsight.

294 00:27:07.190 –> 00:27:14.390 Jason Charnes: So well, I don’t want to say that we actually had. You know, I met a lot of really good people that I wouldn’t have known outside of that

295 00:27:14.500 –> 00:27:18.240 Jason Charnes: by having them come, speak, which is kind of the whole idea of the Cfp.

296 00:27:18.580 –> 00:27:19.090 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

297 00:27:19.090 –> 00:27:21.220 Jason Charnes: So I wouldn’t say that I would have thrown it out.

298 00:27:22.060 –> 00:27:31.749 Jason Charnes: but I think if I were to do it again I might try the Jason sweat cell where he select like he doesn’t do a Cfp. He’s just like, do you want to come talk? Do you want to come talk? I think I probably

299 00:27:32.250 –> 00:27:34.850 Jason Charnes: like am aware of

300 00:27:35.070 –> 00:27:38.540 Jason Charnes: enough people in the community that I could pull that off. But at the same time

301 00:27:39.000 –> 00:27:46.000 Jason Charnes: I don’t know like there’s also there’s more people that I would get to meet with the Cfp. But I’m kind of again I digress here. But

302 00:27:47.900 –> 00:27:52.089 Jason Charnes: To the question of volunteers. What do we do?

303 00:27:53.350 –> 00:27:56.359 Jason Charnes: It was mostly so like when it came to the actual like.

304 00:27:56.650 –> 00:28:02.780 Jason Charnes: Then you, Ernie, and I and Shannon, would all look together.

305 00:28:03.290 –> 00:28:11.680 Jason Charnes: came to sponsorships earlier. We do that came to like food, and like managing all that, Shannon. Usually my wife, did most of that. So we we’re pretty good team.

306 00:28:12.240 –> 00:28:13.290 Jason Charnes: Ernie is.

307 00:28:14.550 –> 00:28:22.500 Jason Charnes: Ernie is one of the finest humans in the world. I think everybody who’s ever worked like worked with him in any capacity says that. So.

308 00:28:22.500 –> 00:28:23.733 Travis Dockter: Hmm! Nice

309 00:28:28.400 –> 00:28:41.769 Travis Dockter: Oh, I had another question. I lost it. Oh, what was so the 1st year in the blog post you mentioned. You sold 87 tickets. How did it did it? How much bigger did it get over the years?

310 00:28:41.910 –> 00:28:44.380 Travis Dockter: Did you ever like sell out or.

311 00:28:44.690 –> 00:28:52.499 Jason Charnes: No, never, never sold out. The second year we had ample amount of space.

312 00:28:53.070 –> 00:28:54.300 Jason Charnes: We.

313 00:28:56.460 –> 00:29:04.559 Jason Charnes: for all intents and purposes, broke even. I can’t remember the number of tickets we sold, but it it surpassed 100. I think the second year is our biggest year.

314 00:29:06.150 –> 00:29:12.730 Jason Charnes: The 3rd year did really well, too. So the 3rd years we finally did do a hotel.

315 00:29:15.180 –> 00:29:18.419 Jason Charnes: So we did one downtown Nashville.

316 00:29:19.010 –> 00:29:22.069 Jason Charnes: and we use their space, their event space. So

317 00:29:23.780 –> 00:29:31.800 Jason Charnes: even if it wasn’t more tickets in the second or 1st year the space is a little smaller. So it felt packed. It felt full. It was cool.

318 00:29:31.800 –> 00:29:35.909 Travis Dockter: Yeah, it was over a hundred, both those other, the second and 3rd years.

319 00:29:36.110 –> 00:29:37.240 Jason Charnes: Oh, sorry! What was that?

320 00:29:37.470 –> 00:29:39.010 Travis Dockter: It was over a hundred.

321 00:29:39.010 –> 00:29:51.330 Jason Charnes: I wanna say, if it if it if it wasn’t, it was around there, you know it was pretty steady the first, st you know every time I give you a number I’m gonna include the 15 speakers, too, right? So like

322 00:29:52.090 –> 00:29:55.468 Jason Charnes: you at least have 15 people at your conference, no matter what

323 00:29:55.750 –> 00:29:56.635 Travis Dockter: Right.

324 00:29:57.520 –> 00:30:04.989 Jason Charnes: We stayed pretty steady. We were fortunate in that regard, and you know we did 3 arguably, vastly different conferences.

325 00:30:07.680 –> 00:30:12.160 Jason Charnes: Cause. We change locations pretty dramatically within Nashville all 3 times. So.

326 00:30:12.160 –> 00:30:13.250 Travis Dockter: Right, yeah.

327 00:30:13.250 –> 00:30:14.390 Jason Charnes: We’re pretty fortunate.

328 00:30:14.820 –> 00:30:16.540 Travis Dockter: Nice gotcha

329 00:30:19.480 –> 00:30:36.269 Travis Dockter: can you? Think of anything that you did in the conference? That? Maybe you didn’t think at the time was a big deal, but afterwards people came up to you, and they’re like, Wow, I’m so glad you did this thing or this thing was so cool. Is there anything like that.

330 00:30:36.270 –> 00:30:43.470 Jason Charnes: Yeah. And it wasn’t even my idea. So keep ruby. Weird was a conference in Austin. That

331 00:30:44.050 –> 00:30:47.359 Jason Charnes: is one of the greatest regrets of my life I never got to go to

332 00:30:48.371 –> 00:30:53.779 Jason Charnes: terrence Lee was one of the organizers. Terrence works at Heroku.

333 00:30:54.320 –> 00:31:00.569 Jason Charnes: Say, Terrence is on Ruby core. Really smart individual we were talking at Rubyconf.

334 00:31:01.560 –> 00:31:02.509 Jason Charnes: I don’t know

335 00:31:03.390 –> 00:31:09.010 Jason Charnes: Kansas, maybe rails, Comp. Kansas City. I don’t know something right before southeast ruby and I was just talking to him about it.

336 00:31:09.250 –> 00:31:15.689 Jason Charnes: he said. The thing we do is we do 30 min talks, 30 min. Break 30 min talk, 30 min break.

337 00:31:15.930 –> 00:31:18.670 Jason Charnes: And I was like that is so much downtime.

338 00:31:19.690 –> 00:31:21.750 Jason Charnes: But let’s try it. And

339 00:31:22.080 –> 00:31:39.200 Jason Charnes: again, not my idea. Everybody loved that format like. If anybody talked to me about southeast ruby, it was always I love. How much like time there is to talk to people. And I’m like, cool, yeah, like, I’m really glad. So that is something we kept every year.

340 00:31:39.760 –> 00:31:41.789 Jason Charnes: and it’s not I mean.

341 00:31:42.160 –> 00:31:48.630 Jason Charnes: it works in in that format because it’s single track, I mean, minus the day. We had the workshops, but it’s single track.

342 00:31:49.650 –> 00:31:52.799 Jason Charnes: There’s not a ton of people there. So like

343 00:31:52.950 –> 00:32:03.120 Jason Charnes: you’re in small space, you end up kind of just talking to people, even if you’re not real social. You’ll probably end up talking to someone, and I think that was the thing that always like made that special to people.

344 00:32:03.460 –> 00:32:11.519 Travis Dockter: Yeah. Did you? Did you borrow anything else from like conferences that you went to? You saw stuff you liked and brought that to.

345 00:32:11.890 –> 00:32:13.514 Jason Charnes: Yeah, I I really.

346 00:32:16.630 –> 00:32:22.519 Jason Charnes: I wanted to try and bring the like. Ruby rails, Comp experience on like a smaller scale.

347 00:32:22.630 –> 00:32:27.589 Jason Charnes: But I can’t think of anything I did that was unique, you know, like

348 00:32:28.527 –> 00:32:41.190 Jason Charnes: arguably. Maybe we had too many keynote speakers, even for a like regional conference, because we always. I want to say we always had 4, except for the last year we only had 2. But that was because we it was technically single day.

349 00:32:45.880 –> 00:32:47.919 Jason Charnes: Yeah, I’m trying to think

350 00:32:50.770 –> 00:32:56.119 Jason Charnes: things. I wish I would have borrowed from conferences, not doing lunch like it’s just.

351 00:32:56.120 –> 00:32:56.730 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

352 00:32:57.500 –> 00:32:59.040 Jason Charnes: We were really fortunate.

353 00:33:00.080 –> 00:33:06.849 Jason Charnes: We you know, we had a few people with like dietary restrictions we had to watch out for, and they were actually always super grateful

354 00:33:07.350 –> 00:33:10.339 Jason Charnes: like. It was easy to just, you know, be like

355 00:33:11.680 –> 00:33:20.289 Jason Charnes: it was easy to set up. People are always grateful for that, but I wish I had just been like you. I want to say, like ruby on ales which used to happen.

356 00:33:21.220 –> 00:33:23.030 Jason Charnes: I want to say in Oregon.

357 00:33:24.060 –> 00:33:28.660 Jason Charnes: I think it was that conference, or some conference that predated me

358 00:33:29.110 –> 00:33:34.639 Jason Charnes: I was told would be like, yo. Here’s $2030, voucher, you know, like, go eat lunch somewhere.

359 00:33:35.000 –> 00:33:35.890 Travis Dockter: Oh, nice!

360 00:33:35.890 –> 00:33:46.440 Jason Charnes: If it wasn’t Ruby on ales it was. It was another one. Maybe it was like Rocky Mountain. But I was like, Oh, that’s a cool idea, like, you know, it’s just baked into the price, because, like, you’re gonna spend that.

361 00:33:47.290 –> 00:33:48.470 Travis Dockter: On catering, anyway.

362 00:33:48.470 –> 00:33:53.529 Jason Charnes: Yeah. And it’s, you know, the 1st 2 years, because we weren’t at a hotel. We were like.

363 00:33:55.360 –> 00:33:59.059 Jason Charnes: we’re working with restaurants directly, and they have to come, deliver it and.

364 00:33:59.060 –> 00:33:59.690 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

365 00:33:59.976 –> 00:34:09.989 Jason Charnes: Actually, it’s a 3rd year, even even though we were at a hotel, we still catered food like we had a minimum for food included. So we did like coffee and candy and stuff. But

366 00:34:11.023 –> 00:34:22.339 Jason Charnes: you know effectively, you end up paying $20 a head for the shittiest box lunch ever. So it’s like, why not give you $2030? You can go, you know.

367 00:34:22.889 –> 00:34:32.339 Jason Charnes: even in downtown, Nashville you could eat lunch pretty well, you know, on 23 bucks, or you know, or just like other conferences. Just don’t give them any money and say, like.

368 00:34:32.500 –> 00:34:34.639 Jason Charnes: there’s 2 h like, it’s enough time.

369 00:34:34.790 –> 00:34:38.109 Jason Charnes: Wish I would have done that. I think it might have been more enjoyable.

370 00:34:38.679 –> 00:34:40.619 Jason Charnes: maybe, for the attendees as well.

371 00:34:44.889 –> 00:34:52.250 Jason Charnes: I liked. I really liked having a conference

372 00:34:52.909 –> 00:34:57.050 Jason Charnes: sanctioned event outside of the conference.

373 00:34:57.560 –> 00:35:02.470 Jason Charnes: So the 1st year that was the the bar at the

374 00:35:03.490 –> 00:35:09.910 Jason Charnes: at the venue. The second year we actually rented out

375 00:35:10.615 –> 00:35:17.760 Jason Charnes: like the upper floor of a bar, and just had like snacks and drinks, and like it was you. You got like tickets and stuff.

376 00:35:18.110 –> 00:35:27.319 Jason Charnes: you know, and I was like watching the check the whole night like thinking that was the thing actually always surprised me is whenever we do event like that even like the speakers, dinners.

377 00:35:28.065 –> 00:35:39.184 Jason Charnes: which we could talk about, I always would be like, you know, like, Oh, shit like this is going to be so expensive, and surprisingly, it was always lower than what I thought it would be every time like

378 00:35:39.650 –> 00:35:41.589 Jason Charnes: that is always surprising to me.

379 00:35:41.710 –> 00:35:42.490 Jason Charnes: But

380 00:35:43.470 –> 00:35:52.360 Jason Charnes: in the 3rd year. What event did we do? I don’t remember, but that was something that I really liked doing. I don’t know if we got that from another conference, or what, but having some kind of like

381 00:35:52.780 –> 00:35:57.199 Jason Charnes: optional conference, sponsored social gathering was always a success.

382 00:35:57.820 –> 00:35:58.590 Travis Dockter: Nice. Yeah.

383 00:35:58.590 –> 00:36:00.179 Jason Charnes: At least my perception of it.

384 00:36:00.760 –> 00:36:03.800 Travis Dockter: Yeah. Tell me about the the Speaker’s dinner?

385 00:36:04.480 –> 00:36:10.475 Jason Charnes: Speaker Center was one of those things that’s like, Hey, I can’t pay for your travel.

386 00:36:11.010 –> 00:36:17.420 Jason Charnes: but I at least buy you a meal. Yeah, and that was always cool, selfishly, because

387 00:36:20.350 –> 00:36:23.500 Jason Charnes: it was a chance for me to like. Hang out with, you know.

388 00:36:23.770 –> 00:36:27.120 Jason Charnes: with keynote speakers who, you know if I’m

389 00:36:27.880 –> 00:36:35.089 Jason Charnes: you know, speakers, you know. I invited them so like obviously like, I kind of hold them in kind of like a high regard already. But then, also like

390 00:36:35.647 –> 00:36:41.690 Jason Charnes: that’s how I got to know Jason. Sweat like, you know, he the year he spoke like we had Speaker dinner

391 00:36:41.900 –> 00:36:43.000 Jason Charnes: hung out.

392 00:36:43.110 –> 00:36:46.380 Jason Charnes: I got to spend time with Noah Gibbs. It just, you know.

393 00:36:46.890 –> 00:37:05.072 Jason Charnes: It was a cool chance for them to meet, but it was also just a really cool chance for me to get to spend some time with them. And and every year we did, you know. And again, the 1st year I was like, Hey, we’ll cover food, but not alcohol. But it was. The bill was so cheap. I was like, what so like, you know, by the second 3rd year is like dude. Get whatever you want.

394 00:37:06.130 –> 00:37:08.960 Jason Charnes: yeah. And like, I think by the last year we had gone to like.

395 00:37:10.780 –> 00:37:14.640 Jason Charnes: not like the fanciest one in the world like we were at a steakhouse like

396 00:37:15.086 –> 00:37:20.780 Jason Charnes: that was like at the top of a building in Nashville, like it was super cool. So

397 00:37:21.200 –> 00:37:22.349 Jason Charnes: we had some.

398 00:37:22.670 –> 00:37:24.650 Jason Charnes: We have some cool experiences with that.

399 00:37:24.650 –> 00:37:25.400 Travis Dockter: Nice.

400 00:37:25.640 –> 00:37:27.700 Jason Charnes: Definitely recommend that if you can swing it.

401 00:37:28.080 –> 00:37:38.490 Travis Dockter: Yeah, yeah. Would you? Are there anything else? I guess that you

402 00:37:38.930 –> 00:37:45.020 Travis Dockter: wish you would have done that. You wish you would have spent more money on, or put more time into.

403 00:37:48.090 –> 00:37:52.596 Jason Charnes: It might be impossible, but I wish I would have attended the conference more.

404 00:37:53.610 –> 00:37:55.349 Jason Charnes: I was able to the 1st year.

405 00:37:56.450 –> 00:37:58.710 Jason Charnes: but by the second 3rd year it was just.

406 00:37:59.020 –> 00:38:00.780 Jason Charnes: There are too many moving parts.

407 00:38:01.190 –> 00:38:01.700 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

408 00:38:04.900 –> 00:38:15.330 Jason Charnes: I every year, all 3 years. I tried to record the talks on video.

409 00:38:16.520 –> 00:38:28.619 Jason Charnes: and I regret even trying, because what it did was. I still have hard drives of these videos, but I never had the time to. I didn’t have the money to pay someone to do it, and I never had the time to go. Do all of them.

410 00:38:28.800 –> 00:38:32.070 Travis Dockter: And so I regret even.

411 00:38:32.640 –> 00:38:41.613 Jason Charnes: Trying to do that because it’s left me with a sense of like failure in a way. Because, you know, the speakers like they probably looked forward to that like they probably wanted that

412 00:38:41.870 –> 00:38:42.550 Travis Dockter: Hmm.

413 00:38:42.790 –> 00:38:50.110 Jason Charnes: So I wish I had kept it like simpler in that regard. Not trying to do everything.

414 00:38:50.720 –> 00:38:54.969 Jason Charnes: I there’s something else that came to my mind.

415 00:38:58.430 –> 00:39:03.020 Jason Charnes: I wish I attend the conference more. I wish I would have recorded video.

416 00:39:05.150 –> 00:39:06.579 Jason Charnes: Oh, there was one other one.

417 00:39:08.550 –> 00:39:13.159 Jason Charnes: I wish I would have tried harder with sponsors the 1st year. Sponsors. Really.

418 00:39:16.510 –> 00:39:23.109 Jason Charnes: in my experience, sponsors have always been super chill, like.

419 00:39:23.670 –> 00:39:31.580 Jason Charnes: As long as you do what you say you will, like, you know, in exchange.

420 00:39:31.580 –> 00:39:32.810 Travis Dockter: Pretty easy to work with.

421 00:39:32.810 –> 00:39:38.110 Jason Charnes: Yeah, like to be. They typically want you to succeed as well like.

422 00:39:38.110 –> 00:39:38.430 Travis Dockter: You know.

423 00:39:38.430 –> 00:39:39.330 Jason Charnes: They’re not.

424 00:39:41.040 –> 00:39:44.520 Jason Charnes: It benefits both of you, and it really helps.

425 00:39:46.390 –> 00:39:53.940 Jason Charnes: I’ll tell you something that we did. I really liked. I don’t know if I would do it again. I really liked being in a hotel the last year.

426 00:39:54.160 –> 00:39:55.270 Travis Dockter: But.

427 00:39:55.880 –> 00:39:58.749 Jason Charnes: Typically with hotels. You have to do a room block.

428 00:39:59.210 –> 00:39:59.600 Travis Dockter: See.

429 00:39:59.600 –> 00:40:03.009 Jason Charnes: Have to, you know, have to be like, well, we’ll you know

430 00:40:03.620 –> 00:40:09.360 Jason Charnes: we’ll rent these 30 rooms, and you know, if only 20 people do, then we’ll pay. You’re on the hook for the last 10.

431 00:40:09.570 –> 00:40:10.060 Travis Dockter: Right.

432 00:40:10.060 –> 00:40:15.970 Jason Charnes: That was stressful. But we filled our block at least so

433 00:40:18.210 –> 00:40:21.160 Jason Charnes: it was tricky, right, like we filled it.

434 00:40:21.490 –> 00:40:23.049 Travis Dockter: Is. It’s always a risk.

435 00:40:23.220 –> 00:40:28.367 Jason Charnes: Yeah, like, it worked out. I don’t know that I want to like experience that again. Yeah,

436 00:40:28.670 –> 00:40:33.850 Travis Dockter: Why did you like the the experience of being in a hotel? Was it just because it was easier to keep everybody in the same place, or.

437 00:40:33.850 –> 00:40:40.609 Jason Charnes: Yeah, and not everybody stayed there, you know, like, I mean, we had locals, but we also, you know, it was not the cheapest place you know. We.

438 00:40:40.910 –> 00:40:41.210 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

439 00:40:41.210 –> 00:40:45.290 Jason Charnes: I had friends still like doing Airbnbs and stuff. Yeah, but

440 00:40:49.130 –> 00:40:59.300 Jason Charnes: it was nice, because there’s a lot more opportunity like you walk downstairs, and people are in the restaurant or at the bar, and like it just created a lot more opportunity outside of the conference to see people.

441 00:40:59.640 –> 00:41:06.129 Jason Charnes: and I enjoyed that I also liked.

442 00:41:08.830 –> 00:41:13.299 Jason Charnes: I. When I go to conferences I always try and get the

443 00:41:14.820 –> 00:41:19.280 Jason Charnes: like. If I go to, I’m going to rails, conf in a couple weeks. And

444 00:41:20.610 –> 00:41:26.850 Jason Charnes: there’s the the hotel they have, and I always try and get the one they like recommend, like, same thing with rails. World.

445 00:41:26.970 –> 00:41:29.970 Jason Charnes: Yeah, because, like, that’s where the speakers are.

446 00:41:30.450 –> 00:41:32.460 Jason Charnes: That’s where people are hanging out.

447 00:41:32.600 –> 00:41:43.840 Jason Charnes: And if the conference does it there, too, there’s something nice isn’t seem to get me like, Oh, it’s like 2 o’clock, and I just I can’t do it right now. Just be able to go up to your room. Yeah, like.

448 00:41:44.820 –> 00:41:48.160 Travis Dockter: It’s a. It’s a nice thing. Yeah, very convenient.

449 00:41:48.723 –> 00:41:51.059 Travis Dockter: Do you have a a favorite conference.

450 00:41:52.890 –> 00:41:54.469 Jason Charnes: Like I’ve ever been to.

451 00:41:54.890 –> 00:41:55.710 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

452 00:41:55.800 –> 00:41:57.230 Jason Charnes: That’s tricky.

453 00:41:58.400 –> 00:42:00.379 Jason Charnes: Sin City’s up there.

454 00:42:04.180 –> 00:42:11.980 Jason Charnes: I have just like a weird fascination with Vegas. I’m not even a big gambler, but like I have like a shelf in my office like

455 00:42:12.190 –> 00:42:14.056 Jason Charnes: with Vegas stuff on it.

456 00:42:15.190 –> 00:42:27.059 Jason Charnes: I actually, the year before sweat, decided Houston City. I’d started looking at doing a conference, a ruby conference in Vegas. I just never pulled the trigger on it, and I’m glad, because

457 00:42:27.490 –> 00:42:29.240 Jason Charnes: sweat did all the work for me. And I got to.

458 00:42:29.240 –> 00:42:33.830 Jason Charnes: Yeah, but since he’s up there probably is one of my favorites.

459 00:42:34.040 –> 00:42:40.010 Jason Charnes: the not just because it was Vegas, but it had all the like.

460 00:42:42.450 –> 00:42:43.909 Jason Charnes: How do I describe it?

461 00:42:44.230 –> 00:42:47.500 Jason Charnes: It had all the pieces to like kind of make it special.

462 00:42:50.420 –> 00:42:55.989 Jason Charnes: You can go do whatever you want pretty much right like Vegas, never shuts down.

463 00:42:56.180 –> 00:42:56.870 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

464 00:42:58.280 –> 00:43:03.040 Jason Charnes: One of my favorite memories is a group of people, not this past year, but in 2020

465 00:43:03.730 –> 00:43:07.190 Jason Charnes: 3, I guess, was the last time or 2022, whichever one.

466 00:43:07.560 –> 00:43:14.859 Jason Charnes: like a bunch of us, ended up in Old Town in downtown Vegas and Fremont Street the last night, and like

467 00:43:15.240 –> 00:43:27.880 Jason Charnes: they’re teaching like one Guy’s teaching everyone how to play craps, and everyone’s just having a blast like everybody’s, you know. That’s the conference was fun. He always sweat, always had good technical speakers.

468 00:43:27.880 –> 00:43:28.570 Travis Dockter: Hmm.

469 00:43:29.930 –> 00:43:33.919 Jason Charnes: It was so laid back. Yeah, that was always special to me.

470 00:43:34.030 –> 00:43:40.529 Jason Charnes: The 1st rails. Comp. I went through in 2015. It wasn’t like special, but it’s special to me, because

471 00:43:42.700 –> 00:43:48.450 Jason Charnes: Like I’m at Aaron Patterson. I’m at dhh, and like

472 00:43:49.069 –> 00:43:54.519 Jason Charnes: not that they like remember me like right, but like it was special to me, because these are people like I.

473 00:43:54.800 –> 00:43:56.909 Jason Charnes: I’ve read so much of their stuff. I’ve watched some

474 00:43:57.540 –> 00:44:02.890 Jason Charnes: talks and stuff like I met Aaron Patterson, and he was like, Here, here’s a sticker of my cat.

475 00:44:03.170 –> 00:44:11.280 Jason Charnes: and I was like, that’s so smart like that gives him like a thing to like, connect with someone without having to like, necessarily carry a conversation. I thought it was genius.

476 00:44:11.440 –> 00:44:11.790 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

477 00:44:12.125 –> 00:44:16.149 Jason Charnes: That one’s special to me because of that. It actually made me.

478 00:44:16.960 –> 00:44:20.339 Jason Charnes: It’s the 1st time I got to see the ruby community like in person.

479 00:44:20.580 –> 00:44:26.729 Jason Charnes: and it was just it was kind of special to me. And that and rails ruby central as a whole.

480 00:44:29.390 –> 00:44:35.129 Jason Charnes: I know, like things got weird with rails, Comp. And rails. World stuff like that, but like Ruby central as a whole.

481 00:44:36.900 –> 00:44:44.949 Jason Charnes: especially like Evan and Abby Phoenix. They Marty, hot like all of them who were on Ruby Central that time.

482 00:44:45.440 –> 00:44:47.959 Jason Charnes: And it’s they made those conferences.

483 00:44:48.110 –> 00:44:49.250 Jason Charnes: They were good.

484 00:44:49.720 –> 00:44:56.660 Jason Charnes: They’re really good. They were well oiled like machines even. I don’t know if it was like that behind the scenes, but it appeared that way, and.

485 00:44:56.930 –> 00:44:57.540 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

486 00:44:57.810 –> 00:45:03.980 Jason Charnes: I don’t know. It holds a special place in my heart, cause it it for the last

487 00:45:04.620 –> 00:45:06.269 Jason Charnes: god. Almost 10 years

488 00:45:06.460 –> 00:45:16.879 Jason Charnes: shit for the last 10 years has been like, it’s helped me. It’s been the avenue by which I gained new relationships. New friends, new

489 00:45:19.030 –> 00:45:28.589 Jason Charnes: you know everything. Yeah. So yeah. And rails world’s fun. I don’t know. I don’t think I’ve been to a conference. A ruby conference I don’t like is maybe the best way to describe it.

490 00:45:28.880 –> 00:45:29.550 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

491 00:45:30.390 –> 00:45:34.510 Jason Charnes: Except for maybe the year at Ruby Comp. Where they didn’t have water.

492 00:45:34.820 –> 00:45:38.029 Travis Dockter: Oh, a great water debacle!

493 00:45:38.030 –> 00:45:40.259 Jason Charnes: Yeah, that was tough.

494 00:45:40.930 –> 00:45:54.040 Travis Dockter: Alright. Well, deal we’ll wrap this up here so you can get back to your day. But do you have any

495 00:45:54.720 –> 00:46:05.049 Travis Dockter: resources that you would recommend for 1st time conference organizers, or any people that you would recommend, that I talk to next in this kind of format.

496 00:46:06.231 –> 00:46:09.478 Jason Charnes: I think you’re building the resource

497 00:46:10.540 –> 00:46:11.290 Travis Dockter: This Podcast.

498 00:46:11.290 –> 00:46:13.098 Jason Charnes: You’re building the resource for people.

499 00:46:13.750 –> 00:46:17.059 Jason Charnes: because the thing I did was try and talk to people who had done it.

500 00:46:17.729 –> 00:46:24.180 Jason Charnes: When Jeremy Smith started. I think he like I think I talked to him about some of this stuff.

501 00:46:24.520 –> 00:46:25.120 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

502 00:46:25.610 –> 00:46:27.829 Jason Charnes: And I know. I think you talked to Jeremy recently on this.

503 00:46:28.280 –> 00:46:37.049 Jason Charnes: Yeah, I would, Jeremy. I love Jeremy Smith. He came to southeast ruby.

504 00:46:38.490 –> 00:46:46.250 Jason Charnes: I think the 1st year he was like, Hey, is there a place to like park a camper van like it was awesome and but like

505 00:46:46.640 –> 00:46:55.709 Jason Charnes: we didn’t really become friends. It’s like a moment. I know I’m diverging here, but it was like a moment for me. It’s actually Sin City Ruby. I want to say. The 1st year we had breakfast.

506 00:46:55.860 –> 00:46:57.709 Jason Charnes: and it was like me.

507 00:46:58.830 –> 00:47:07.046 Jason Charnes: I can’t remember who I was there, but Jeremy was there. It was just 4 of us, and we just started talking. Jeremy is such a good dude, anyway.

508 00:47:10.830 –> 00:47:16.630 Jason Charnes: you’re talking to people if you haven’t already reach out to Jason. Sweat.

509 00:47:17.365 –> 00:47:17.729 Travis Dockter: Yep.

510 00:47:17.730 –> 00:47:18.330 Jason Charnes: You know.

511 00:47:18.960 –> 00:47:19.510 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

512 00:47:19.510 –> 00:47:27.680 Jason Charnes: I know his experience. I don’t want to speak for him, but I know his experience this year with the Tropicana, where he did the 1st 2 cent cities with it being gone.

513 00:47:29.570 –> 00:47:37.109 Jason Charnes: Changed his experience. You do it at the Mgm, yeah, because, like, it’s a much bigger.

514 00:47:37.820 –> 00:47:38.410 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

515 00:47:38.410 –> 00:47:40.840 Jason Charnes: Much bigger entity, with much higher

516 00:47:40.970 –> 00:47:47.210 Jason Charnes: expectations, were like the tropicana. I mean, just walking in there. You’re like, oh, this place doesn’t give a shit about anything.

517 00:47:47.210 –> 00:47:47.709 Travis Dockter: Yeah. It’s all.

518 00:47:47.710 –> 00:47:48.500 Travis Dockter: Also.

519 00:47:48.500 –> 00:47:51.459 Jason Charnes: What made that place so special? Right?

520 00:47:51.850 –> 00:47:52.490 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

521 00:47:53.150 –> 00:47:59.250 Jason Charnes: But yeah, no, I think definitely. Talk to Jason. Sweat if you can.

522 00:47:59.560 –> 00:48:05.320 Jason Charnes: If you could find any of the people who used to do. Keeper be weird like Terrence Lee, Richard Schneeman.

523 00:48:06.065 –> 00:48:10.315 Jason Charnes: Caleb. I can’t remember Caleb’s last name right now, but

524 00:48:12.210 –> 00:48:14.849 Jason Charnes: There’s also I don’t know. I don’t know.

525 00:48:15.160 –> 00:48:18.809 Jason Charnes: Maybe he helps with Keeper be weird, but Nicholas means

526 00:48:19.070 –> 00:48:21.280 Jason Charnes: he’s a conference speaker for sure, like

527 00:48:22.490 –> 00:48:25.940 Jason Charnes: he’s got a lot of conference experience, even if he’s never organized one.

528 00:48:26.330 –> 00:48:26.720 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

529 00:48:26.720 –> 00:48:28.710 Jason Charnes: You might try and find Nicholas and tell him that.

530 00:48:29.508 –> 00:48:36.200 Jason Charnes: I recommended him because he is just a plethora of knowledge, and one of my favorite human beings in the world.

531 00:48:36.520 –> 00:48:53.429 Travis Dockter: Awesome. Yeah, yeah, I plan to like, after I interview a bunch of organizers. I also want to interview speakers about their experiences, and just like people who have been to a bunch of conferences. And yeah, just get get all kinds of perspectives. But.

532 00:48:53.430 –> 00:48:57.019 Jason Charnes: Yeah. You talked to Marty. Hot, right? That was.

533 00:48:57.020 –> 00:48:58.130 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

534 00:48:58.300 –> 00:49:06.649 Jason Charnes: Evan Phoenix also might be a good one, or, if you could talk to, I don’t know if she would want to. Evan’s wife Abby was one of the like

535 00:49:08.250 –> 00:49:12.139 Jason Charnes: core people who made the ruby and rails comps happen for a while.

536 00:49:12.280 –> 00:49:22.920 Jason Charnes: Nice I don’t know if she would be interested in going on podcasts. But she was like, I worked with her like a couple of times. And like, they’re just yeah, they’re they’re great people. So.

537 00:49:23.120 –> 00:49:23.890 Travis Dockter: Awesome.

538 00:49:24.150 –> 00:49:26.480 Jason Charnes: Sorry. That’s that’s probably more than you wanted. But.

539 00:49:26.630 –> 00:49:32.420 Travis Dockter: No, no, that’s good, that’s good. Gives me a lot of homework. Alright! Well, hey.

540 00:49:32.420 –> 00:49:33.280 Jason Charnes: Conference.

541 00:49:34.230 –> 00:49:35.290 Travis Dockter: So it’s

542 00:49:35.490 –> 00:49:48.560 Travis Dockter: right now, I’m thinking I’m gonna call it blast off rails. Just cause I I don’t know. I I want to do a conference, but I want to

543 00:49:49.580 –> 00:49:59.529 Travis Dockter: it different. Like I wanna do, you know, talks or workshops. But I’m also thinking I want to do just like

544 00:50:00.329 –> 00:50:12.089 Travis Dockter: I don’t know. Event type stuff like one of my ideas is, I need to find somebody that’ll be willing to do this. But have you seen the show hot ones.

545 00:50:13.010 –> 00:50:15.530 Jason Charnes: Yeah, I I know what you’re talking about. Yeah.

546 00:50:15.530 –> 00:50:25.289 Travis Dockter: I want to do like a hot ones interview with, like, you know, a rails community, you know, famous person, and like, get them up because it’s New Mexico, right? We have.

547 00:50:25.290 –> 00:50:25.870 Jason Charnes: Right.

548 00:50:25.870 –> 00:50:43.860 Travis Dockter: Stuff bring them, and they can like try Chili, and we can ask them questions, and it’ll be entertaining like, I kind of want to do like entertainment type stuff at the conference, too. So I’ll probably blast off rails, and I’m I’m gonna try and do it in June of next year. So giving myself a year

549 00:50:44.270 –> 00:50:50.320 Travis Dockter: and I’m glad I did, because everything is taking longer than I thought it would, so.

550 00:50:50.320 –> 00:50:51.210 Jason Charnes: Listen.

551 00:50:51.420 –> 00:50:53.859 Jason Charnes: I’ll tell you this. I know we’re out of time. But

552 00:50:54.458 –> 00:51:03.229 Jason Charnes: one thing I want to mention to that point is, I almost brought back southeast ruby 2 years ago. But

553 00:51:03.580 –> 00:51:05.499 Jason Charnes: I said if I was gonna do it.

554 00:51:05.940 –> 00:51:08.749 Jason Charnes: I was going to do it in Memphis, because I live here.

555 00:51:09.370 –> 00:51:16.050 Jason Charnes: And I was going to just like, be like Yo, we have like 6 speakers.

556 00:51:16.660 –> 00:51:29.069 Jason Charnes: And we’re just gonna like hang out like it’s basically gonna be an excuse to just invite all of my ruby friends. And anyone who wants to come hang out like, you know, just I think there’s

557 00:51:30.280 –> 00:51:34.820 Jason Charnes: there’s something special there. I like that idea. I like your idea like,

558 00:51:36.050 –> 00:51:38.119 Jason Charnes: that’s cool. Is there a reason.

559 00:51:38.120 –> 00:51:45.000 Travis Dockter: Because they they are about the talks, but they’re about the hallway track 2 and the experience

560 00:51:45.627 –> 00:51:50.910 Travis Dockter: and I kind of want to like elevate the stuff outside of the talks.

561 00:51:51.465 –> 00:51:58.170 Travis Dockter: You know, just to just to see what I can do and see what what we can create there. But.

562 00:51:58.170 –> 00:52:01.760 Jason Charnes: Yeah, is there a reason? You’re

563 00:52:03.420 –> 00:52:06.700 Jason Charnes: going with like more specific like rails than ruby.

564 00:52:08.410 –> 00:52:11.729 Travis Dockter: Yeah. So I’m

565 00:52:12.770 –> 00:52:33.929 Travis Dockter: so one of the after my interview with Marty Hot, he recommended a book about like, I think it’s called the art of gathering, which is like about like creating the, you know, gatherings. Aka conferences. And one of the things in there was to

566 00:52:34.940 –> 00:52:37.300 Travis Dockter: like narrowing your purpose.

567 00:52:38.230 –> 00:52:40.880 Travis Dockter: Can be beneficial because it

568 00:52:41.150 –> 00:52:50.199 Travis Dockter: it can make people want to participate more rather than saying, like, we’re, you know, we’re a ruby conference for anybody who loves Ruby. Just come.

569 00:52:50.200 –> 00:52:50.830 Jason Charnes: Right.

570 00:52:50.830 –> 00:53:06.159 Travis Dockter: That that can be that can work for something like Ruby Central, because they have this Institute. People know them, but for myself, I feel like. If I did something really general, it might not give people enough reason to come. So if I went

571 00:53:06.160 –> 00:53:28.590 Travis Dockter: narrow and I haven’t. I kind of want to go even narrower than rails, but I just haven’t committed to anything yet. But like if I did rails like Builders Conference, where it’s just like all the talks are themed around like what people have built with rails. And all the activities are like building stuff with rails like, I feel like, if I

572 00:53:28.720 –> 00:53:32.200 Travis Dockter: went narrower I might be able to

573 00:53:32.430 –> 00:53:37.000 Travis Dockter: get people to want to come a little bit more. That’s the

574 00:53:37.000 –> 00:53:39.410 Travis Dockter: theory at this point. But yeah.

575 00:53:39.410 –> 00:53:42.362 Jason Charnes: No, I was just. I was actually just curious. I I have no

576 00:53:43.790 –> 00:53:51.710 Jason Charnes: no hard stance either way. I was just curious, because, you know, most of the time when we do these regional things. They are like ruby, but.

577 00:53:51.710 –> 00:53:52.390 Travis Dockter: Right, yeah.

578 00:53:52.390 –> 00:53:57.090 Jason Charnes: Of the talks end up, being not all of them, but a lot of them end up just being well in rails and rails and rails.

579 00:53:57.090 –> 00:54:02.720 Travis Dockter: Yeah. Well, somebody I really want to talk to is Andrew.

580 00:54:03.590 –> 00:54:07.119 Travis Dockter: I can’t remember his last name he did rail. Sas.

581 00:54:07.120 –> 00:54:10.409 Jason Charnes: Oh, Andrew Culver, yeah, look at that one. Yeah.

582 00:54:10.410 –> 00:54:12.859 Travis Dockter: Yeah, because that was kind of

583 00:54:13.150 –> 00:54:25.650 Travis Dockter: kind of like what I want to do. Like he had a it was a very narrow niche, like it’s rails, and it’s sas and I’ve heard so many good things about his that that conference as well, that I’ve.

584 00:54:25.650 –> 00:54:32.519 Jason Charnes: Yeah, that conference was that conference was also special, and and for like different reasons, it was really cool.

585 00:54:32.790 –> 00:54:33.480 Travis Dockter: Yeah.

586 00:54:33.850 –> 00:54:36.459 Jason Charnes: Cool. Well, I’ll stop. I’ll stop interrogating you. I.

587 00:54:36.460 –> 00:54:37.330 Travis Dockter: Yeah. No worries.

588 00:54:37.330 –> 00:54:38.780 Jason Charnes: Learn more, so.

589 00:54:38.780 –> 00:54:40.980 Travis Dockter: No worries. Always good talking with you, Jason.

590 00:54:40.980 –> 00:54:42.180 Jason Charnes: Yeah, likewise.

591 00:54:42.180 –> 00:54:46.269 Travis Dockter: Your time. And are you gonna be at rails? Comp. This year? The last one.

592 00:54:46.590 –> 00:54:52.890 Jason Charnes: Be at rails. Confidence right now be at rails world. So all the all the rails.

593 00:54:53.110 –> 00:54:59.200 Travis Dockter: Yeah, I didn’t. I didn’t get a rails world ticket, but I will. I will see you at at rails. Comp.

594 00:54:59.200 –> 00:55:01.090 Jason Charnes: All right. I’ll see you a few weeks, then.

595 00:55:01.090 –> 00:55:04.259 Travis Dockter: Yeah, Yup, alrighty! Take care, man, I’ll talk to you.

596 00:55:04.260 –> 00:55:05.380 Jason Charnes: I appreciate it.

597 00:55:05.670 –> 00:55:06.490 Travis Dockter: All right.